Lalaland's "The Challenge"

kipling71 · **Posted:** Thu Mar 28, 2013 12:23 pm

Has anyone else gotten this yet? Feels like they put back some of the high-end which I wasn't aware of missing in the Prometheus release until I heard this one. There's a bit of hiss in the quieter cues that's gonna drive some people to distraction, but I'd call it an improvement.

However, does anyone feel like they magicked away some of the percussion in "The Wrong Sword"? I remember being more aware of the metal mixing bowls before but on the new disc they're barely there. Or am I remembering it wrong?

I'm delighted this one's back out there. According to iTunes, this is one of my most-played Goldsmith scores! Never seen the film - is it worth a look?

RM Eastman · **Joined:** Thu Dec 15, 2005 11:51 pm **Posts:** 361

Posted: Mar 30, 2013 - 5:44 AM
By: RM Eastman (Member)

I began listening to LaLa's "The Challenge". I stopped after Track Two(2) "The Wrong Sword"-

totally missing are the steel mixing bowls????? There absince for me totally ruins this brilliant cue.

Either LaLa should have a recall of this flawed remaster, or I am going to return both copies for a

tharpdevenport · **Posted:** Fri Mar 29, 2013 11:00 pm

I've become more aware of missing stuff from recent releases in the last few years. Note: I'm not singling Intrada out, I just happen to remember more instances from their releases.

So far we have mixing bowls missing from that track in "The Challenge" (LLLR). As an FSM member asked: What about the cue "Fish Market"?

On "Something Wicked This Way Comes" (Intrada; Horner), there is a sort flute part missing from one cue (I assume it was probably an overlay), and of course the harmonica at the end of the film before the end credits kicks in.

The percussion is missing or mixed down to be almsot unheard, on one of the "Conan the Barbarian" cues (as multiple people have pointed out; other missign stuff has been addressed by Doug and Roger, but so far I've not seen this one covered). I don't recall the cue name at the moment.

There some piano missing from one cue on the rejected "Gladiator".

And of course there's the infamous missing chorus from the reboot Trek 2CD set (Varese), but I recall that was a cost issue.

When LLLR released "Star Trek V: The Final Frontier", they included the original Arista presentation. Problem is, they didn't simply remaster it, they toyed with it. In "Open the Gates", for those who have the actual Arista CD, you'll notice you can hear the metronome clicking away with the music. It works wonderfully with the music, though I'm sure it was not intentional. At one poit the music gets quite and you can hear it prominently. The LLLR mastering, removed that from the Arista presentation. I have no idea if Intrada fixed that in the re-issue.

And one seperate listing, since it wasn't so much as missing, as it was a different take apparently:
On "Baby: Secret of the Lost Legend", there's an electronic synth sound that utters like three times (I dont' remember the cue at the moment); on the take Intrada cue, it's only like once ,and the third time it would have appeared, a short flute flutter mimicing it, takes it's place.

I'm probably forgetting something.

kipling71 · **Posted:** Sat Mar 30, 2013 6:24 pm

Lalaland has spoken and apparently the paperwork they were assembling their CD from indicated that the take of "Wrong Sword" on their CD (without 20-odd seconds of mixing bowls) is actually the take used in the film and the one with the mixing bowls from the Prometheus release was not, but Goldsmith requested the latter's inclusion on the previous CD. Interesting. Too bad everyone involved is dead 'cuz I'd love to know if Goldsmith was too "way out" for his producer/director in this instance ("Yeah, that was nice, Jerry, but maybe cool it on the mixing bowls?") or if the bowls needed to be eliminated to clarify some other audio element in the mix. Shame the film is not available.

Obviously the usual suspects over on the FSM board are crying foul and accusing everybody of everything. Some are DEMANDING that the new guidelines (read ABSOLUTELY INVIOLATE LAWS, SET IN TITANIUM) for album assembly are that all interesting alternate versions of cues MUST be included - except, of course, when such alternate versions are annoying and repetitive. Enjoy your chosen professions, soundtrack producers everywhere!

Terry Cloth · **Posted:** Sat Mar 30, 2013 10:02 pm

Douglass Fake · **Joined:** Sat Nov 19, 2005 3:48 pm **Posts:** 2773

T. Newman Fan · **Posted:** Mon Apr 01, 2013 6:47 pm

That made me wonder as well. Bruce's "Tech Talk" notes for Gladiator mention that it consists of live mixes and we hear exactly what was played with no remixing or overlays to consider.

tharpdevenport · **Posted:** Mon Apr 01, 2013 7:13 pm

Douglass Fake · **Joined:** Sat Nov 19, 2005 3:48 pm **Posts:** 2773

SchiffyM · **Joined:** Sat Dec 17, 2005 8:35 pm **Posts:** 253

Boy, when a bootleg is considered evidence of the "proper" presentation (as in this case, there's no other way to hear this music), we really have reached a new level of delusion.

kipling71 · **Posted:** Tue Apr 02, 2013 12:48 am

Conrad · **Posted:** Tue Apr 02, 2013 8:28 am

I think one possible factor behind these queries is that the version you hear first can get implanted in your mind as the 'right' one. You become so familiar with it that any version you hear subsequently can sound strange.

Despite this tendency, I find I usually prefer official versions of things I've become familiar with via poor quality, unprofessionally produced unmentionables. In fact, the listening experience is often revelatory. The quantum leap in quality reveals instrumentation previously buried in hiss or a bad mix, and the improved dynamic range allows the music to breathe and reveal nuances you never heard before. At the very least, I try to embrace the changes as a new listening experience. In any case, I always assume the professionals' version is the 'right' one.

As for 'The Challenge', I guess I'm lucky because I've never heard it before, so the mixing-bowl-less version will become my first experience of it and no doubt be fixed in my mind as the 'right' one ... I can understand how disappointing it must be for others who have become so accustomed to the Prometheus version. I hope everyone hung onto it ...

Jay · **Joined:** Mon Jul 26, 2010 9:10 am **Posts:** 331

tharpdevenport · **Posted:** Tue Apr 02, 2013 4:25 pm

Douglass Fake · **Joined:** Sat Nov 19, 2005 3:48 pm **Posts:** 2773

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Lalaland's "The Challenge"

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